Betar

He was born in Penamacor and didn’t have a childhood linked to the arts. You studied Mechanical Engineering at Técnico and ended up working in property development and hotels. How did this passion for art begin?

I remember when I was 16, I visited the Museum of Ancient Art and I didn’t like it, I thought it was too well painted, it was almost photography. I recognize that it’s invaluable, but I like contemporary art better, which is what you see here in the museum. When I was 18, two friends and I would get together to discuss stock market deals and which silkscreens we were going to buy. That’s how it started. Until I was about 23, I kept buying silkscreens and, when I turned 25, I decided to stop with “the paper”, as I called it, and bought my first original work of art, a José Ribeiro, which is on display in the Collector’s Room in Gallery 1. From then on, I always chose to buy originals. Until the mid-1990s I only bought 20th century Portuguese. From then on, I started thinking about preparing the collection to open a space to the public – at the time I didn’t know if it was really a museum or another space, like a gallery – and I started buying international works and works of other dimensions. The works from the Portuguese 20th century were pieces that I could put in my house, so I could look at them, but from a certain point onwards that was no longer possible, because they were pieces with a different dimension, and because I also started buying sculpture, installations and, later, photography and video. It wasn’t easy to get into these last two areas, it took me a while to understand them, but this wing [Gallery 2] has a lot of interesting photography and I’m very happy about that.

What has driven you for 50 years? Did you buy out of instinct, impulse or taste?

Yes, all my works were bought without advisors, I bought because I liked them. Of course, I had three or four gallerists who would present me with works and, from among them, I would select the ones I liked best. That’s how I created the collection. I often say that these works speak more for me than anything I can say, there’s a bit of my soul here. And I’ve had a lot of positive feedback from all the people who have visited us. On the Saturday of the inauguration, we had 5200 people and on Sunday around 5500, it was a surprise to me, I frankly wasn’t expecting so many people. Let’s hope it stays that way in the future, because it’s our intention to share this collection with the city of Lisbon and all the people who want to visit us, so that they can enjoy it. What is on display now, in Galleries 1 and 2, represents around 25 per cent of the collection. Of course, from time to time we’ll change a few pieces. Then in Galleries 3 and 4, in the new building, there are temporary exhibitions. We have registered a brand, so to speak, which is ‘The House of Private Collections’, so that those floors can receive private collections from people who have nowhere else to show their collections, if they justify it. The idea is to have a national and an international collection. We already had an international one selected for the opening, by one of Spain’s biggest art collectors, but as there was no certainty about the delivery date of the work, we decided to open with two exhibitions from our own collection. But in six months’ time, we will certainly put on this Spanish collection.

His collection has around 600 works. Do you have a favorite?

One of my favorite pieces is by Eduardo Viana, ‘The woman with the orange’, because the whole of Lisbon is there, a very pretty saleswoman with an orange in her hand, then other poorer saleswomen and a bully smoking behind the pretty saleswoman… The people are represented there, I really like that piece. Next to it is his most emblematic piece, ‘The Boy with the Crockery’, which was greatly influenced by Sonia Delaunay, who lived in Portugal and was very close to Eduardo Viana. Then there’s ‘Maio de 68’ by Maria Helena Vieira da Silva, which is also very interesting. That was the year I joined Técnico. In Paris there were those riots with the students, an influence that also reached Portugal, and we all ran in front of the police… That’s what happened at the time.

What made you want to share your collection with the world? And how did you feel when you finally saw your collection on display?

I always thought it would be very selfish of me to keep the works in storage, without showing them to anyone, not even myself, there are works here that I haven’t seen for 25 or 30 years. In fact, I didn’t even exhibit much work at home, I had several storage rooms suitable for keeping the pieces, some I kept in safes. The possibility of exhibiting them to the public, so that they can be seen, so that people can enjoy them, is my contribution to the city. For example, I think archaeology sometimes makes the mistake of leaving interesting pieces buried where no one can see them… I wanted my collection to be on display so that everyone could benefit from it. I was proud to do it, of course, and I’ve had lots of people praising and thanking me. It was, in part, the realization of a dream, which doesn’t end here, we’ll continue to acquire pieces, we’ll renovate, it’s a legacy that I want to leave so that my children and grandchildren can continue it.

The creation of the hotel was intended to be the engine for financing and sustaining the project, correct?

Yes, when I decided to create a public exhibition space, I immediately thought that I would have to find an activity that would support the costs because, unfortunately, a museum is not profitable. We have a hotel with 64 rooms, a restaurant, cafeteria and the chapel will also be a venue for concerts and poetry. We believe that this way we’ll be able to cover the costs and free up some money to continue acquiring works.

But with several works on display, the hotel ended up being imbued with the same artistic spirit. Is this another way of publicizing Portuguese art and offering guests a unique experience?

The hotel also has original works, as do the gardens, the access to the garage and the garage itself… The idea is that the whole space is linked to culture, that all the spaces available can publicize art, and that guests can enjoy the museum.

And about the chosen space… you chose to refurbish an 18th century palace, full of history, to which you added modernity with new buildings…

Yes, rehabilitating the palace was another big job and the final project was incredible. This project was conceived for Cais do Sodré, and there was a public tender for the exploitation of a space that I won. At the time, the architect Ricard Bofill did a marvelous project for the space but, for reasons I still don’t understand, I was stripped of the concession. Anyway, at that point I decided that I would buy my own space so that I wouldn’t have to depend on anyone. Here I’m not dependent on the council, the government or the banks, everything was done with my own capital and the project was great. We also have the Palácio do Correio-Mor in Loures, and I’m still going to try to replicate this project there. I’ll see if I still have the courage to do it.

This interview is an integral part of Revista Artes & Letras #175, april 2025
Partially automatic translation from portuguese: some expressions may differ from their actual meaning.